Ted Cruz (Bipartisanship / Conversation) vs. Donald Trump (Wall / Deportation FAST!) IMMIGRATION Debate – IOTW Report

Ted Cruz (Bipartisanship / Conversation) vs. Donald Trump (Wall / Deportation FAST!) IMMIGRATION Debate

Wednesday, 4 November 2015, 23:10 Mr.Pinko Uncategorized 86

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86 Comments on Ted Cruz (Bipartisanship / Conversation) vs. Donald Trump (Wall / Deportation FAST!) IMMIGRATION Debate

  2. You really don’t know when a politician is jerking your chain – “bipartisanship”, “debate”, “conversation” = more of the same old nothing-gets-done Washington bullshit.

  9. We get it – you don’t like Trump.
    You don’t want a wall. You’re for a wide open border. You don’t want deportations. You don’t want one of the BEST BUSINESS-MEN in America to fix our economy.
    You sound like a Liberal who wants HILLARY to win.

  14. Let’s do this: As long as we’re going to go around and around on this wall argument, can we at least have some basic understanding of the border fence’s history, legislation, and arguments?

    Menderman, you keep pressing for a concrete plan and specifics, but you refuse to say anything about your own concerns about it.

    I’m sure we’ll find even more to argue about in this link, but it’s a start. That is if the real goal is to have an honest debate. If not, and this is just an exercise (insert physical expression of your choosing), what is the point?

    Trump — Real immigration enforcement, not endless “reform.”

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mexico_%E2%80%93_United_States_barrier

    Oh, and I just heard today that some of Rick Perry’s supporters are going with Cruz. Rick Perry was all in on open borders in TX and didn’t want a wall. He wanted a that squishy “pathway to citizenship” amnesty stuff.

  15. How are you being an asshole? Well, firstly by intentionally mis-characterizing my positions. I hate Hillary, like Trump and want boarder security, but you think you can win by saying:

    “We get it – you don’t like Trump.
    You don’t want a wall. You’re for a wide open border. You don’t want deportations. You don’t want one of the BEST BUSINESS-MANS in America to fix our economy.
    You sound like a Liberal who wants HILLARY to win.”

    You know that’s bullshit, and you are an asshole for doing that.

  17. I’ve been to the Texas boarder. There will be no wall, ever! I live a few hundred feet from another boarder, the Atlantic Ocean. There will never be a wall there either. Walls won’t fix it, laws, enforced laws will.

  18. Sounds like you’ve got all the information on that. Please tell me how he doesn’t build a wall in TX. And provide specifics, please. We put a few men on the moon and all that, you know? Are you saying it’s physically impossible? Legislatively impossible? Texans will revolt? What?

    Where there’s a will, there’s a way. Border states should not have the ability to stop a wall if it affects the rest of the country’s security.

  19. Wow. I thought you learned your lesson last time I kicked your ass on that subject Mendie. You are truly a right brain thinker. You want to do the accomplishment vs proposal thing again. It was fun.

  21. I’ll rebut

    *Cruz owned the media a lot harder than Trump

    Trump owns the media. I don’t see Cruz getting invited to SNL.

    *Being a senator is not something derogatory

    A junior Senator thumbs bills up and down. Obama was a Senator and look where it got us. Trump is has CEO experience.

    *Trump promises to kick out all the illegals, and bring them right back, and call that legally. Cruz wants to kick them out and keep American immigration policy.

    Cruz is FOR H-B1. Trump wants the illegals to come back LEGALLY and will stop them from illegally re-entering OVER AND OVER!

    * Also, Mexico won’t pay, and to actually believe that is insanity and it’ll be great for Trump to blame no border wall on Mexico.

    And that’s where the poster shows his stupidity. Trump WITHHOLDS the money we give Mexico to pay for the wall.

    * Trump’s ego will be satisfied with being president, and not keeping his promises will make him fit right in with the others.

    And then his ass is booted out of office after 4 years. You think Trump wants to be President to fail and NOT Make America Great Again? His ego is too big for that.

    * How many other American presidents went down as the biggest fools in history for not keeping their promises? This whole point is an absurdity only a Trumpkin would hoot, holler and fall for.

    And YOU’RE a Charlie Brown that keeps thinking a politician is going to fix things in America. Keep kicking at that GOP football.

    * I’d rather a stance on a TEMPORARY WORKER VISA POLICY that allows workers to come in and work so long as they’re needed, than Trump’s desire to let “Syrian” “refugees” in.

    ??? Trump is against Syrian refugees entering the U.S. – the writer is a LIBTARD fool!
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Qgr7xlyW94

    * “Kicking illegals out and keeping them out will result in plenty of jobs that need filling, so we’ll do fine with workers on temporary VISAS instead of terrorists and illegal immigrants, thanks.

    Who wrote that? Anthony Bourdain? How about AMERICANS fill the jobs?

    * Cruz has been ignored as much as possible by the media, because everything he says turns their agenda on its head and punts it. They can’t put anything he says on their media, because they have nothing to say in response to it, that he can’t use to wipe the floor with them.

    Cruz gets ignored by the media because Cruz has no clout and is treated like a Republican clown.

    * Trump flip flops on every issue, so the elder socialists get their gratification that he’s supporting their issues, and the younger ones get their comic book villain to scream at. Every time the media tried to destroy Trump, they promote him, and then he can go say something liberal, and get more press.

    ??? – Trump owns the media has name brand.

    * The media knows conservative Americans loathe them and will like who they say to hate, so they hate Trump instead of Cruz for tactical reasons, the main ones being that it makes them look good for having perfect straw men from a Trump flip-flop to attack, and because it lets them promote a candidate they think their leftist overlord can beat.

    ???

    *He likes a bill that promotes free trade. He no longer supports it, because; ““As a general matter, I agree (as did Ronald Reagan) that free trade is good for America; when we open up foreign markets, it helps American farmers, ranchers, and manufacturers,” Mr. Cruz said, announcing his switch in an op-ed for Breitbart News, a conservative website that has been a vigorous critic of the Trade Protection Authority (TPA) bill known as “fast track.”
    “But TPA in this Congress has become enmeshed in corrupt Washington backroom deal-making, along with serious concerns that it would open up the potential for sweeping changes in our laws that trade agreements typically do not include.”
    And so he doesn’t support it, put your concerns to rest.

    LOL – Cruz fucked up. Nice spin.

    * Trump, who thinks Hillary would make a great president, in case you forgot, would never come close to saying anything like that, he just repeats rhetoric his clueless Trumpkins can get behind, “ITS GAINST MURICA JAWBS”.

    Obviously hates a New Yawker. And that’s the core of his issue.

    * He expresses “concern” instead of making a real argument because he has nothing to go on there, so it’s just doubt creating. Whoever Mr. Pinko is, I do not trust him now.

    LOL – yeah I’m not to be trusted – whoever I am.

    * Trump likes to rub that in everyone’s face. I’m sure Bill Clinton doesn’t control him completely, but since he told him to run, there’s something there.

    yeah – and your guy is beholden by big donors.

    * “Controlled by big donors” is nice layman rhetoric that gets the Trumpkins uppity against the “MAN” and means nothing. He took money from the Koch brothers, and hasn’t supported any of their most recent developments.

    Where does his crap come from?

    * They give money to everyone in the Reb. party so they’ll be nice to them, that doesn’t mean he’s controlled.

    I guess you don’t know how big business works. Jealous of Trump’s billions?

    * Also, if supporting Israel, being against traitors, illegal immigrants, back-room Washington cartels deals, and everything else he supports is being controlled by those particular big donors, then tell those big donors to run for president, or at least to start controlling Trump.

    ???

    *GOP will promote Bush like it promoted Regan’s opposition. They can spent twice as much money as Hitlery to put a shiny saddle on Jebbie, everyone knows it’s an old horse, and no one wants that ride. What were his poll numbers again? Kanye West would make a better opposition, even if he spent his own money.

    Wait till the GOP pulls their shit because the vote is split and Bush squeezes in or just as bad – Rubio.

    * Also, Cruz is raising more than any other candidate with under $100 contributions from regular citizens, and has a treasure trove waiting in his war chest. While Trump does has the money to convince every Mr. Pinko in every news outlet to support him, and and army of trolls to comment on everything, Cruz has the tea party, the grassroots, the religious (maybe one more clueless religious person wants to vote for Trump because his favorite verse is “the whole bible, just the whole thing”) and niches of support everywhere, because he consistently holds to all the right issues.

    Cruz can not win against Hillary Clinton.

    * Trump is a bandwagon for people who don’t listen to news beyond last week, and him running against his buddy’s wife Hillary should show any sane person he’s the ultimate POLITICIAN whose PROMISES are worthless and is EFFECTIVELY the only way the ever-hated Hitlery can win.

    The G.O.P. fucked up and Trump is their punishment! If you want the same old political bullshit, go ahead, knock Trump out of the race and then cry in November 2016.
    I won’t be around to tell you “I told you so”

  28. You’re thinking of a literal wall in areas where none can be physically built. The entire TX border does not offer a geographic impossibility though. In fact there are walls and open areas linking those walls with detection and surveillance technology. In that case there are stretches of the TX border that are considered secure if ICE is allowed to do their jobs. Problem solved.

    Your continual pressing for an answer coupled with your predetermined opinion that a wall cannot be built in TX “ever” has made it difficult to discuss. Now I know you are convinced it can never be done.

    Do you think it’s Trump’s fault that you cannot be convinced and *he* is wrong for that reason?

  30. Oh, and as far as the land owners surrendering land to the federal government for the wall, I’m willing to bet they would all say hell yes. Probably apt better than drugs and muzzies being smuggled past your house in the middle of the night.

  32. OMG, well we’d both come up zero’s wouldn’t we. I’m done. I feel like Honestly this had that old “arguing with Libs” feel to it. You’ll never see my point, I’ll never see yours. I hope Cruz gets nominated and your light finally comes on during Hillary’s second term.

  33. Abigail, Cruz wants to increase boarder security thru various aircraft, fixed wing, drone and rotary wing. He proposes tripling (and in some instances more) the budget to make a “virtual” wall to stop walk-ins. Mr. Pinko denigrates him for that. Mr. Pinko posts pictures of big beautiful wall with big beautiful doors as if that will stop illegal immigration. I assure you it will not. A physical boundary is appealing, but much more is needed. The political will of the people is required whether you like it or not. Trumps sad faced rhetoric will not stop illegal immigration, nor will his stump speeches. It is sad to me that Mr. Pinko thinks we need to appeal to the lo-fo’s in order to repair this country. I refuse to accept that.

  35. The Great Chinese wall is 13,179 miles long! The southern U.S./Mexico border is a little less than 2,000 miles. Israel built a border fence around the Gaza strip that resulted in a 100% decline in suicide bombers. They also have a “Green Line” fence. There are nearly 50 such border security fences/walls existing in countries worldwide. Serious discussions are underway in Europe to erect additional border fences to stop the flow of unwelcome migration.

    I don’t understand this as an argument at all. You can’t seriously believe that a border security wall of that length is an impossibility or even that hard to do.

  39. Abigail, the Rio Grande/Rio Bravo alone is almost 2K miles, mostly in Texas. The math you are using is a straight line on paper, but rivers don’t run that way. And even if the river ran straight and true, what side of the river and lakes will we build that fence/wall on? Are we gonna build it on the Mexican side or take the land away, Kelo style, from Americans and build the wall on our side?

  40. Face palm. So we went from 1200 years, to mechanization and explosives to slaves are better because they reproduce, but that damn wall can’t be built. I’m getting a real clear picture now.

  49. I like Trump and Cruz. President Donald Trump and Vice President Ted Cruz. – has a real nice ring to it.
    If Trump doesn’t make it. Oh well. No wall. No deportations. I tried 😉

  50. “It is sad to me that Mr. Pinko thinks we need to appeal to the lo-fo’s in order to repair this country. I refuse to accept that.”

    How do you think Presidents get elected? Politically educated public?

  51. Menderman, You must be confusing me with a whole ‘nother body because I’ve never said anything, nor has anyone else said anything about usurping the “political will of the people” — whatever you might mean by that. I’m a people, too, and Trump has certainly grabbed my attention with the idea that someone finally gets that I’m angry as hell that I worked my butt off to elect people who told me they were going to do something about illegal immigration, but silly me! They were just kidding — hahaa!

    I’m sure people like Catherine Englebrecht is just laughing her damn ass off right now over how very silly it all was to be attacked by the the IRS and all it’s affiliate agencies because she took all those people seriously, too.

    So guess what? Now I hear those sickening weasel words coming straight out of Ted Cruz’s mouth; capitulation words like “we’re gonna have a conversation” and get all chummy in “bipartisanship” and don’t forget, everyone, I’m the king of “debate.” And you know what, Menderman? I’m just sick, sick, sick beyond sick up to my eyeballs with HEARING IT!!

    So give me and my fellow Americans who have been taking it in the teeth since, like, I don’t know, FOREVER!! a big, fat, tall, wide, WALL!!

    See, that’s all we want. We don’t care how it gets done. Just do it.

    Don’t you ever come at me again with your careless words.

  56. My comments at Salon and moveon are treated better by the commentators than here. They call me names too, but even they don’t twist my words. I’m fed up. We are here bitchin’ and complainin; and fixin’ to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.

    Fuck it. I don’t need to be a part of it. I have mine, and don’t need anymore. Y’all just keep on being assholes. It iOTWr is gonna be this way, I want no part of it…………….the assholes win.

  58. Either you want a wall or you don’t want a wall. I want a nice big wall. If Trump says it can be done, I believe him. If he’s lying, gets elected and no wall – we’re back at square one. No different from a politician’s broken promise. IMO – Trump is worth the shot.
    Watch this video – do you think we can build a wall where the crappy, broken fences are?
    Agreed?
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4dbtRF3bWzs
    …

  60. Yeah, whatever. We won’t agree on this, so there’s no sense in pursuing it further. Your issue is Kelo, mine isn’t right now. I live in a huge metro area, my kid attends an enormous university with over 60K people on it. We live in a sanctuary city in a sanctuary country. I know a huge number of the people she might encounter on any given day are here illegally and I don’t even want to think about the number of them who have prior arrests, including felonies. See, it’s not academic to me and it’s not about “property” rights, it’s about people I love and how devastated and enraged I would be to lose them at the hands of some piece of filth that shouldn’t have been here.

  66. ROFLMAO, are you sure you’re not a Prog, you did go to UNCW eh?

    Progs have a real problem with self awareness, something you’re exhibiting in great peacock splendor.
    You look maaaviols darling.

  69. You continually mischaracterize my words, not that I expect anything else from a paid shill.

    I was a big Cruz supporter, changed my mind, something you seem unable to even contemplate. I want a winner, if Cruz wins the nomination I will gladly go and vote for him. Can you say the same for Trump?
    Seems you are intent on throwing down gauntlets, in a battle of wits, you’re an unarmed man.
    Normally I don’t ridicule the hapless, willing to make an exception in your case.
    Typical Prog behaviour.

  72. Forget the wall. Dredge the border to make a moat and fill it with razor blades. This is a geographic possibility anywhere and doesn’t interfere with Texans view across the border and doesn’t take away existing private land.

  74. I am against the idea of “Kelo” as anybody. Private property rights are a foundation of Liberty. But (there has to be a but in this case), the need for our security is so overwhelming we have to take land to build a wall. The only other option that I can see is the military (or heavily armed Boarder Control) is on the boarder, and that will not work, cause they are not going to shoot kids.

  75. I agree. It’s shameful that we find ourselves arguing here about a situation that we’ve been placed in by the left and their increasing pact with groups like La Raza (the race) and others who have infiltrated our country in order to bully Americans into submission over our legal sovereignty. We should have both our property rights and confidence that our elected officials will protect and defend our immigration laws.

    It’s beyond irony, though, that one of the main arguments is over property rights when the entire issue IS property rights — the right to say where our country begins and Mexico’s country ends. And the right to say to Mexico, “No! Your people and those who have apparently breached your immigration laws illegally do not have a God-given right to breach ours!”

    Mexico doesn’t care! They help their own people break our laws. Remember the pamphlet “Guide for the Mexican Migrant”, giving detailed instruction on navigating deserts and swimming rivers safely. Their people said it was to ensure their safety, but everyone laughed at the mendacity.

  76. Guys, the fight isn’t in here, it’s out there.
    Knock it off, shake hands, and get behind whoever the nominee is. We are all a part of a family here at iotw…Start acting like it, and quit calling each other names. That’s what liberals do.

    Don’t make me fart!

  77. You are the one being an asshole, anyone would think that a wall is the equivalent of setting up a colony on Mars….fuck off; it’s a wall,…I’d say get over it but that would defeat the purpose.

  78. Cruz supporters are blind to the fact that Trump has a better shot at beating Hillary than Ted Cruz. Unfortunate that they get so irrationally rabid about their candidate when facts are presented.
    If it wasn’t for Trump, Cruz would’ve been bowing out by now, like Walker. We need to get behind ONE candidate BIG because the GOP will pull so much shit your head will spin. They’re doing it now with Carson against Trump. Trump screws the G.O.P.e and the G.O.P.e will do whatever they can to stop Trump.
    Cruz supporters stubbornness is going to get us Jeb or Rubio.
    Think strategically. 😉
    You’ll get your Cruz Presidency in 2020 or 2024.

  82. The BORDER is on FEDERAL LAND. No one is getting their property taken away from them.
    And if that was ever the case – I would bet you any amount of money the owners of border property would be very willing to let a wall be built on the edge of their property.

  83. A healthy disagreement is productive. This argument is over the more important aspect of “whoever the nominee is” and that’s who gets the nomination that can convince enough voters of all stripes. If we get to the convention and nominee can’t deliver the GE, we made a big mistake and it’s too late to change it.

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