McFartus writes- Thank you for helping us. We read them all, our daughter read them too. She seems better today. Please let your community know we are very thankful for all the kind and supportive comments.
I was wondering if the iotw community can help me and the wife. Last night my daughter’s classmate, a 16 year-old junior, committed suicide.
The school opened late today and the students were told in home room. My kid knew him, as most did.
My question to iOTW:
Has anyone experienced this before? She is pretty emotional and was with counselors this afternoon.
We, however, haven’t been.
If anyone has advice for me, I really could use it.
-McFartus
Turn to Christ!
Yep – talk to Jesus.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UAnySx2lHC8
Farther Along – by the Peasall Sisters
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k1dVxCa77sI
The peace of God which passes all understanding will fill your heart and mind thru Christ Jesus.the pain felt is by those left behind and only Christ can ease the burden but the pain will remain for ever.i do not judge the one doing the act that is for God to judge for who knows the mind of a person but God.so i say peace to all affected and to the one lost may God have mercy upon your soul….
^^ it was me.sorry using cell phone.
Talk to your LCMS Pastor. He’ll know what’s what.
I’m so sorry! It’s painful and I’ll keep you all in my prayers.
Today’s scripture reading on the Daily Devotional was:
2 Corinthians 1:
“3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies and God of all comfort,
4 who comforts us in all our affliction so that we will be able to comfort those who are in any affliction with the comfort with which we ourselves are comforted by God.
5 For just as the sufferings of Christ are ours in abundance, so also our comfort is abundant through Christ.”
https://www.intouch.org/read/magazine/daily-devotions/the-god-who-comforts
The religious advice above is all helpful. If you are a member of a church the pastor or youth pastor can be a big help, they are trained for situations just like this.
If not, cloister the family together and provide whatever support you can. Do not ignore the likelihood that your daughter will internalize some blame. She knew the boy and it would be natural for her to second guess her actions prior to the event;what did she do or say to him, was anything she did a catalyst? Friends know when something is not quite right and an inventory or self reflection of past actions on her part could ensue, this should be addressed.
Been there, several times, with family and friends. It’s never easy, especially when it is someone you loved.
People who commit suicide make a choice.
It’s a choice often made from a state of mind befuddled by unfathomable pain, anger, alcohol, drugs, depression or any number of issues.
Still, it’s a choice.
You also have a choice. You can be consumed by grief, the endless questioning “why” and the self-imposed guilt of not recognizing that a loved one was hurting, “or you can choose to learn from the experience, move on and keep the spirit of your loved one in your heart.
Talk about it with close friends. They will listen. Then forgive.
Not a ton you can say about this.
People kill themselves. It sucks for other people when they do. Sometimes, the person committing suicide INTENDS to make it suck for other people. Other times, it’s just supposed to be a suicide “gesture” where a kid jumps off the top of what they think is a harmless pill bottle and arranges to be found, only to discover later they destroyed their liver and will die slowly and painfully, and inevitably, as a result.
I was a medic. I saw some stuff.
I am a parent. I saw some stuff.
I was a teenager. I saw some stuff.
Despite this, I know no “generic” thing to say that could cover this highly individual situation. At some point it needs to be used as a teaching moment, as in ‘you know how bad YOU feel now? That’s how bad OTHERS would feel if YOU tried this. You can ALWAYS come to (Mom, Dad, Pastor, other family member, etc,), if you feel like you may be in trouble’.
That probably should not be until AFTER the funeral, though.
For now, basic comfort, “Being There”, and offering the loving arms of Jesus are the order of the day. I am not nuts about “counselors’ because they tend to steer kids according to a taught agenda these days, and besides, those guys have a pretty high suicide rate THEMSELVES, so I tend to doubt their ability to help OTHERS, particularly Government counselors who have been taught to NEVER invoke the WONDERFUL Counselor, Jesus. Their advice is mostly useless, without HIS.
You love your daughter, or you wouldn’t be reaching out for help for her. Use that love, and your lifetime of wisdom, to bring what comfort you can. But know this;
You
Can’t
Fix
It.
This is GOING to hurt. We want to protect our children as much as we possibly can, but if someone else attacks them in some way, we can’t always STOP the attack, but we CAN limit the damage. Best to keep physically close for now too, as much as she’ll tolerate without feeling “smothered”, so you can “be there”, but also so you can talk if she wants, and more important, LISTEN if SHE wants to talk.
Be attentive to whether her friends may be getting weird ideas that they’re sharing with her about this, too. Sometimes, some kids glamorize this, and some may think that all the love and tears and praise of the dead, is worth dying for THEMSELVES. For this reason, you may want to peek at her social media accounts on the D/L too, just from outside, you know, just to see what the kids are discussing and whether she seems to be having larger problems with it.
But again, it WILL hurt. She WILL have grief. She WILL feel bad. This is normal, and would be alarming if she DIDN’T. Just watch, and BE there, to make sure it doesn’t get overwhelming.
…I do not know her, I do not know you, and I do not know anything but the most basic about the situation. I cannot judge better than you what to do about it. This is why we come back to, and ALL posters come back to, the ONE Man who IS qualified to give ONLY good advice at this time.
That is the Lord Jesus Christ.
“ 3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.”
Revelation 21:3-4
…Only God can wipe the tears. Your job is to help her, let HIM do so…
Just be mindful that some friends, maybe your daughter, might be wondering if she had done or said this or that, her friend might be alive today. Be there for her even if it means a quite time in the living room with her so she can express her grief. Show her some guidance.
Keep her away from counselors unless they are solid Christian counselors and not the type of strict that says the person goes direct to hell and doesn’t pass go.
Most counselors are nit-wits who haven’t worked out their own demons.
I talked to my kids about a high-school senior suicide. “Look around the room. Look at how many people loved that kid. Do you think if he had said to any of them, ‘I am thinking of killing myself,’ that any one of them would have hesitated to try to get him help? If you are thinking about killing yourself, it can’t get any worse. It can only get better. Cry for help.”
My sister’s youngest son (38) recently killed himself. Last year he had taken a huge quantity of various pills he had stashed away to do it, but his stomach was pumped out. A couple months ago he shot himself and was successful. Lots of medical issues and unfaithful wife.
Just talked to my sister on the phone today. Still dealing with it.
Sometimes I wonder if the mimic or rash of surrounding suicides are or aren’t the effect of bad counseling.
There is a journey for all involved to doscover why this girl was in such pain. There are family issues, mostly.
Your daughter’s innocence has been breached by the event, and she could use professional help in guiding her in understanding what could drive a girl to kill herself, and what secrets are likely being hidden. It’s sad she has to access this kindnof information at her age, but if done with care, she’ll grow in a way that is unique and productive. By doing so, she’ll recover, and likely to be of great benefit to people she meets in life.
We all lose our innocence. This is very painful, but of course it could have been worse.
If she does the work of discovery, acceptance and recovery, she’ll become quite a woman.
Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, Courage to change the things I can, And Wisdom to know the difference.
My best friend did this when we were in college. It was a complete surprise to everyone. He had everything going for him (smart, handsome, well liked and well off financially) and showed no indication of being suicidal. I was the last person to see him alive. That was almost 40 years ago. I still, to this day, wonder if there was something I should have seen or done.
The best thing that people did for me was being there to listen when I wanted to discuss it, but not to press me to talk about it unless I wanted to.
McFartus.
First off, I will pray for your daughter as well as the family of the beautiful soul who took her own life as soon as I hit “POST COMMENT.”
Second, guilt might settle in for your kid. “I should have seen it!” Depression is a common human emotion. When it gets dangerous is when it begins to flood the person suffering from it. And then the person slowly believes that they are a burden to everyone and they’d be better off without them. THAT IS THE BIG LIE. That comes from the pit of hell. But it “FEELS” legitimate. Tell your kid she has nothing to feel guilty about.
If you want, you can ask BigFurHat for my email. He has my permission. I have a testimony to read in that area I could email to you for you and your daughter to read. Might be insightful as to what was going on in her friend’s mind. Fur has read it. And feel free to forward it to anyone who might be struggling with the same thing her friend did. It’s why I wrote it.
God bless you all. 🌞
Some souls are just to gentle to face what this world dishes out. Most find a way to block out most of the evil and keep their focus on the positive. It is easier said than done.
Our family, too, has been affected by suicide…..Mrs Chiggerbug’s 24 year old son. We also lost my mom back on Christmas Eve. A pastor friend of ours gave us this advice.
You’ll get through this.
It won’t be easy.
It won’t be quick.
Don’t be naive.
Don’t be foolish.
When all seems lost, talk to Jesus. He can handle the conversation, from crying to screaming. Prayers!
Haven’t read the above comments yet, as I didn’t want them to influence what I would say. I was in this circumstance many years ago myself.
Once was a close friend getting hit by a truck and dying before he hit the ground. The other was another friend committing suicide. The first was in Jr. High, the second in H.S.
Both occasions were very similar to me. My parents, I recall, were a bit more gentle on me for a week or so. They tried to answer my questions, but nothing they could say in either case was convincing or memorable.
Life happens and this is part of it. I still think about both David and Jeremy from time to time. I’ve never shaken either occasion, and because of them I cherish each moment with my loved ones more than my friends and wife, who’ve not experienced such events.
If you’re on this site and asking for help, my hunch is you’ve already prepared your daughter as much as a parent can for such events. Do your best to answer her questions honestly and bluntly, and be gentle on her if she wants to retreat for a week or two. The truth is that her friends can provide more support in the way she needs it than you can. Guide her in what she says about those interactions. Above all, know that you _cannot_ fix it. Don’t even try. It would come across as petty and unconcerned now matter how you present it.
I don’t mean to sound harsh (indeed, I’m tearing up as I write this), but life simply is.
Edits: for clarity.
It’s hit my family, too.
Keep your daughter close. Grief is a very personal thing that takes time to unspool, which is precisely why family is the best to help hold things together. Perhaps a minister, if you’re involved; someone who already knows you.
That aside, I absolutely despise the grief industry. I’ll save the why for another time, because I don’t want to derail the thread with something not very helpful.
Community, counseling, God.
Along with that, a favorite new point comes from Hal Elrod whose mentor long ago told him:
“Go ahead and grieve, be mad, whatever you need to do. For 5 minutes.
When the 5 minutes is up, tell yourself these three words: Can’t Change It. And move on.”
Not easy to do, but that is the reality – you can’t change what happened, but you can change what you are going to do and how you are going to think.
Two more notes: If after a week or two she still wants to hide away, insist that she do her shores and her regular routine.
The next – your daughter is stronger than you think. By now, she’ll be more like your wife than you realize. She’s not your tiny little girl anymore, even though she’ll always be a bit of that to you.
Once or twice in my life I have peered into the blackness of complete despair and hopelessness….from imagining the worst and what I would do about it. It’s not that difficult to feel the feelings of a suicidal person. Think of 2 things: the wrong you have done to others and the wrong things that have been done to you. Throw in the feeling you had when a girlfriend left you or your dog died.
Your self-worth becomes maximum self-hatred. You literally want to hurt yourself- punish yourself for being no good for anything.
To me it was just an exercise…not real, but I imagined it was close to what a suicide thinks.
I have, of course, been depressed – who hasn’t. Once it was bad enough that the colors of the world around me seemed to change to gray….trees and grass were gray, not green.
That episode wasn’t bad enough to kill myself.
Believing in God is the best way to avert suicide.
My prayers go out to you, your daughter and her classmates.
I don’t know if you and I are in the same neck of the woods, but two students from the same high school committed suicide in the last week. I noticed in the local news coverage that the words, “mental health” were mentioned a dozen times. The word “love” was mentioned once, in a sentence something like, “talk to the ones you love about this issue.” God was mentioned not at all. Yet I believe that for all the blather about mental health, love and God are the answers.
May the Lord be with you. All of you on this site. I lurk heavily, comment rarely, because my life is a constant time squeeze. But I love you all.
Wow, this thread shows that suicide reaches deep. It has reached my family as well.
The school will have counselors, let your daughter see them.
The main thing is to keep from allowing too much time to pass from when you know there is a problem, and when it starts affecting your daughter.
Help can come in many forms.
Take what help is out there
Dear McFartus, I am so very sorry for the loss of your daughter’s classmate. Many years ago, I lost a sweet friend to suicide. Barbara Johnson (now deceased) wrote books on grieving. She said three things helped her: tears, talking, and time.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QPJJJdAEjPc&index=8&list=PLzAmgzoHuSDhTYodNkAnJvgTSGFCTnjLe
McFartus.- Sorry to hear that. [And I’m sorry for the others who have had to deal with it]
Please take Jerry Manderin’s offer, McFartus. He’s a wonderful person.
First of all.. I spent 3.5 years from age 17 with a death wish.. I turn 60 in a week…
People do stupid things and make horrible choices.. I’ve lost friends and aquaitences to suicide. It sucks… It pisses me off that they took the cowards way out. Made a perminate decision for temporary problems..
You cannot take responsibility for their bad and stupid choices..
Suicide is the epitome of selfishness
Tell her the truth; Suicide is a completely selfish act designed to ‘get even’ with someone or something by causing them pain. It’s a form of projection.
Research Democrat.
It wasn’t the fault of anyone but the person who committed it.
ACT, and GOD will ACT.
Suicide is an act of (either) a nihilistic mind or an ill one.
Hard to say which, before or after the fact.
I wish there were some magical panacea, but there isn’t – the pain must be endured.
We cannot comprehend what is incomprehensible.
I know my bleating doesn’t help – and I apologize for that.
Suicide is the final act of selfishness, you can’t take it back. My two nieces husbands killed themselves. One of my nieces made out and is living the high-life. She’s with the guy her husband offed himself when he found out, the other one said “F it I’m outta here.” I really don’t think you can say anything to the grieving parties to make it easier on them. My daughter when she was 16 tried to kill herself. The hurt and fear she caused us was unbearable. To this day I still think about it, and it hurts just the same. My daughter got counseling, and we weren’t allowed in on the details. To this day we have no idea what she said to the counselor, but we know the circumstances behind it. She has her head screwed on right now, but the memories never go away. Some find comfort in religion, with my experience, each day will get better.
Crying is good for the soul.
The person who commits suicide is more afraid of living than dying.
Catholics believe suicide is an unpardonable sin, but it’s not.
NOTHING can separate you from the love of GOD.
I love giving my scenario to atheists…
What hope can you give me?
They have no answer